tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post9149697115261491431..comments2024-03-28T21:53:53.990+02:00Comments on Life in Israel: Splitting the mikva or splitting the communityRafi G.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comBlogger129125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-31424418823387143612010-05-02T19:50:40.027+03:002010-05-02T19:50:40.027+03:00As a reader on this website, I feel regarding this...As a reader on this website, I feel regarding this discussion we should all try to remember we are all jews we should all respect each other and respect each person for their practices whether you agree with it or not. And instead of making constant fights over everything that happens in Ramat beit shemesh try and live in peace and work out ways to stop the constant conflicts and in that zechut Moshach will come.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-7963260158754381822010-04-30T02:04:11.459+03:002010-04-30T02:04:11.459+03:00if anyone has a picture of the sign hanging in the...if anyone has a picture of the sign hanging in the mikva about Friday night tevilla bein hashmashot can you send it to us? Apparently Rav Ovadia is being told this never happened. We would like to show him that it did. Please send us an e-mail to beyachadbs@gmail.com . Thanks.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16842186973971975845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-75787891205577061422010-04-28T20:42:46.079+03:002010-04-28T20:42:46.079+03:00[interesting name; I wonder if he chose it to be b...<i>[interesting name; I wonder if he chose it to be based on Hamas the terrorist group or Hamas as in theft? both might apply...]</i><br /><br />המשיג - with a hei.Hamasighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13878878989698459250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-4995191786062529362010-04-28T20:41:31.191+03:002010-04-28T20:41:31.191+03:00I stand by my statement. Can anyone show me one to...I stand by my statement. Can anyone show me one town in this country that has a rabanut eiruv that the local DL do not rely on? Any? DL have always relied on the most lenient eiruv available.<br /><br />More to the point, the reason that there is a chareidi eiruv is not because the rabbonim couldn't sit down together and talk.<br /><br />And even if they would, and there was some sort of concession, it would still be interpreted as giving in to chareidi bullying, illegal interference, etc. yadda yadda. You just can't win.Hamasighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13878878989698459250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-54982540170146907462010-04-28T10:20:32.100+03:002010-04-28T10:20:32.100+03:00Rabbi Malinowitz's reply posted on tzedk tzede...Rabbi Malinowitz's reply posted on tzedk tzedek is missing an apology.<br />He claims that what has been allegedly happening is against his and R. Davidovitz's policy, and people should file complaints with them.<br />How about asking the mikve ladies?<br />How about taking responsibility for what has already happened before you woke up and decided to make sure that the mikve ladies are acting appropriately?<br /><br />As for the DL side, I suspect that they aren't 100% clean either in this controversy. <br /><br />Politics and religion - don't mix well.Sick of the fightingnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-71724461700027273652010-04-28T10:02:02.039+03:002010-04-28T10:02:02.039+03:00Hamsig,
Just a few points.
You stated:
Well perh...Hamsig,<br /><br />Just a few points.<br /><br />You stated:<br />Well perhaps you should consider that unlike bloggers and commentators who freely pour scorn publicly on any nebach who gets in their way, maybe, in fact far more likely, that the chareidi rabbonim, for all their complaints, are not prepared to go as far as publicly criticizing Rav Spector."<br /><br />Of course not. These rabbonim simply use poltical bullying to get their way. They also publically criticize people, schools,organizations and shopping centers that don't meet their fancy.<br />And of course they have the power of the "cherem" (or semi-cherem) to force their positions on others. They ban organizations like Lema'an Achai from advertising and collecting in their shuls but would never ban their members from taking.<br /><br /> "Maybe, just maybe, they have more derech eretz than the rest of us."<br /><br />Derech eretz, yes, by screaming nasty names and titles to David Morris in shul on Shabbos. <br /><br />Ah, what derech eretz.Marbim Shalomnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-25096023261092463782010-04-28T09:40:23.508+03:002010-04-28T09:40:23.508+03:00the city eruv is mehadrin. I dont remember all the...the city eruv is mehadrin. I dont remember all the details now, as it has been a while since I learned the halachos of eruvin, but it is mehadrin.<br /><br />When I first moved in, and the "mehudar eruv" encompassed a grand total of about 2 square blocks, not including my street, I met with a great Talmid chochom in the city to ask him about the eruv. He told me he had met with Rav Spektor about it, he had reviewed the eruv and how it was constructed, and the eruv was perfectly fine for anybody who relies on eruvin in general (some might be more machmir and not hold of any eruv - but for someone who will use an eruv, this is as good as any eruv).<br /><br />A number of years later when learnign hilchos eruvin and the gemara, Rav Spektor arranged a tour of the eruv. I joined the group and took the tour. At the time I knew the halachos better than I remember the details today, but then I saw the eruv in action and it is mehudar.<br /><br />I rely on the city eruv just as much as I rely on the "mehudar eruv" and other eruvim.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-46758245830529427182010-04-28T09:34:15.392+03:002010-04-28T09:34:15.392+03:00"I didn't realize the DL community are wo..."I didn't realize the DL community are working on their own eiruv. As far as I know, they are more than happy to rely on the most lenient eiruv available."<br /><br />I guess the so-called Hamasig doesn't know about R' Spektor's mehadrin eruv. Of course, it seems he doesn't know a lot...<br /><br />[interesting name; I wonder if he chose it to be based on Hamas the terrorist group or Hamas as in theft? both might apply...]Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-37148589766440646632010-04-28T09:33:41.899+03:002010-04-28T09:33:41.899+03:00Hamasig said:
"As far as I know, they are mor...Hamasig said:<br />"As far as I know, they are more than happy to rely on the most lenient eiruv available."<br /><br />Now I wonder if there is any besmirching in this comment?Ain Lo Masignoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-51696837671864364472010-04-28T08:16:27.974+03:002010-04-28T08:16:27.974+03:00As a whole the Charedi rabbonim won't cooperat...<i>As a whole the Charedi rabbonim won't cooperate with the DL rabbonim regarding a tzedaka organization, an eruv or a mikve. </i><br /><br />I didn't realize the DL community are working on their own eiruv. As far as I know, they are more than happy to rely on the most lenient eiruv available.Hamasighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13878878989698459250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-39854596511392677312010-04-28T06:22:14.367+03:002010-04-28T06:22:14.367+03:00all you did is strengthen my point. those are aska...all you did is strengthen my point. those are askanim and rabonim fighting over policy and control. Those arent the regular folk down here. Let the rabbonim hate each other (if they do, I dont know), but us regular people can, and will, still be friends with everyone...Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-9140653303661161602010-04-28T01:17:00.120+03:002010-04-28T01:17:00.120+03:00Rafi,I disagree with what you just said. I have n...Rafi,I disagree with what you just said. I have no doubt that R Maliniowitz does not hate the DL community. I do think that Tombak (who called Jacky Edry several times yesterday threatening להבעיר את השטח ) does. I pretty sure R Pearlstein and R Kofshitz do as well. <br /><br />As a whole the Charedi rabbonim won't cooperate with the DL rabbonim regarding a tzedaka organization, an eruv or a mikve. <br />Are you so sure there is no hate there?Eli Dukerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10733438132131254422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-22681310428990936972010-04-27T23:17:48.620+03:002010-04-27T23:17:48.620+03:00allow me to make a point that I think is being mis...allow me to make a point that I think is being missed...especially in light of the last comment.<br /><br />The women on the right do not hate the women on the left, nor do the women on the left hate the women on the right.<br /><br />This is not a fight between people in the neighborhood. For the overwhelming most part, we all live side by side in harmony. Almost everybody has numerous friends from all parts of the community. This is not a fight between neighbors. This is a technical "fight". People are fighting over a policy that is possibly being set. <br /><br />Don't let this affect your daily relationships with neighbors and friends from "the other" part of RBS. For the overwhelming most part, there is tremendous harmony between people, and this should not change that.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-38371583194638763322010-04-27T23:17:13.507+03:002010-04-27T23:17:13.507+03:00Tzedek-tzedek just posted a post from someone who ...Tzedek-tzedek just posted a post from someone who met with Rav Malinowitz to ask about his view on the mikva story. His answers basically say that he hopes that all rabbis can supervise the mikva so everyone in the community will feel comfortable and that the ladies on the right side have been instructed to let women do whatever they have been told by their rav (even if he is a DL).<br /><br />This post, however, is unclear on many key points, it seems nobody asked important questions to the rabbi:<br />1. Are there differences in halacha between the structure of the pool/well etc. of the current mikva pools on the DL and Haredi sides of the Dolev mikva, and if so, what are the differences and is it important to go to the Haredi side in his opinion?<br />2. Does R. Malinowitz believe mikva ladies should be doing these "super-checks" which are not done in the US, Bnei Brak, most of Jerusalem etc., or does he think the mikva lady should check for hairs on a lady's back, and check her nails, and make sure she is completely covered under the water? (Unless of course some lady specifically requests a more complete body check). In other words, what standard is right for the mikva - a two minute check, a 20 minute, a 2 hour?<br />3. What system is in place for complaints against mikva ladies who DO NOT follow the guidelines - in all of life there needs to be accountability, so if a mikva lady acts in this nutty way, is there someone (and I think there should be a phone number of a WOMAN) to call? And is this sign with a number displayed in the mikva for all to see? I don't see women being comfortable sitting down with a rabbi and discussing how they felt when they were sitting around without clothes on and a lady came at them with a tweezer...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-456754061728944452010-04-27T23:13:42.713+03:002010-04-27T23:13:42.713+03:00To the last commenter:
So far, we've not heard...To the last commenter:<br />So far, we've not heard from any women complaining about the left-side baliyonot, but many complaints about those on the right side. Note that - now why would people with evil stories about the left side not tell them? OR is your take that the women on the left hate the right, but not vice-versa?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-36840784987594879452010-04-27T23:01:52.942+03:002010-04-27T23:01:52.942+03:00Too any commentators seem to think that if only th...Too any commentators seem to think that if only the chareidi rabbonim would tell everyone what the problems are with the left side, and with the left baloniyot, we could solve everything, and they simply have no respect for Rav Spector, and don't care to embarrass the rightious baloniyot.<br /><br />Well perhaps you should consider that unlike bloggers and commentators who freely pour scorn publicly on any nebach who gets in their way, maybe, in fact far more likely, that the chareidi rabbonim, for all their complaints, are not prepared to go as far as publicly criticizing Rav Spector. Maybe, just maybe, they have more derech eretz than the rest of us. And maybe they won't publicly announce exactly why they don't like the left baloniyot, because they actually <i>do</i> care how they feel.<br /><br />Consider that.Hamasighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13878878989698459250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-3507974763357328382010-04-27T23:01:15.338+03:002010-04-27T23:01:15.338+03:00Hamasig, I think you missed the comment from Sick ...Hamasig, I think you missed the comment from Sick of Rumors, which identifies the names with the story.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-42903531962674449842010-04-27T22:50:56.141+03:002010-04-27T22:50:56.141+03:00Anonymous:I know the names of the two very chashuv...Anonymous:<i>I know the names of the two very chashuv rabbonim, but obviously won't identify them here; my purpose of bringing the story..</i><br /><br />Of course you won't identify them. Then you might have to verify if there is the slightest whiff of truth to the story.<br />This way, you can besmirch everyone and no one can say you're wrong!Hamasighttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13878878989698459250noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-23758416404380785042010-04-27T20:35:51.271+03:002010-04-27T20:35:51.271+03:00I never said that david belittled talmidei chacham...I never said that david belittled talmidei chachamim or rabbanim. I said that the bloggers have (I meant the commentators- perhaps I should have been more clear)<br />What I meant was that perhaps you should give the same respect and backing to the rabbonim as you do to david. <br />Rav malinowitz somehow feels that there was an excuse for what was done. Perha he is not as smart as you or perhaps he sees things from a different perspective. (the responsibility of a spiritual leader differs than that of the head of a chesed organization- therefore things can perhaps be seen from a different angle including ramifications of the spiritual growth of the community)<br />Rav shach who was recognized as the leading rosh yeshiva of the entire oilam hatorah, more than once had to come out publicly against other people in order to make sure that oilam hatorah stayed true to its purpose. Was it fun for him to do? No. Did he do it? Yes. <br />If you would opt to say that rav shach was also wrong (or any other term used on this thread) then perhaps rav malinowitz is in good company. (Not I am not equating rav malinowitz with rav Shach- I am just using it as an exmple of how a leader has to do tough things that are not understood by the masses)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-89510880472769828892010-04-27T19:05:19.829+03:002010-04-27T19:05:19.829+03:00anonymous of 4:18 - IYH tomorrow there will be a p...anonymous of 4:18 - IYH tomorrow there will be a post about that. I was going to meet with Rav Malinowitz tomorrow to ask the questions, but someone preceded me and already did yesterday. The final draft is being finalized and will be posted tomorrow.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-28759377270160405762010-04-27T18:51:29.331+03:002010-04-27T18:51:29.331+03:00Excuse me. David has not belittled talmidei chocho...Excuse me. David has not belittled talmidei chochomim. There was no excuse for what was done to him even if the perp is a talmid chochom.<br /><br />The only ones belittled here are those who started up with a system that was working fine in order to wield their opinion and control.<br /><br />Rabbonim who refuse to sit with rabbonim of other "stripes", try to impose their tznius standards on the Dolev mall (which B''H didn't work), will not recognize (and even belittle) organizations that have done amazing things for our community...they actually insult and berate themselves and the Holy Torah which they represent.<br /><br />Darcheah Darchei Noam...Talmidei Chochomim are supposed to bring shalom. <br /><br />If they are doing nothing but further machlokes then perhaps...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-88105579167415937152010-04-27T18:22:57.898+03:002010-04-27T18:22:57.898+03:00What does that have to do with the topic at hand. ...What does that have to do with the topic at hand. If david morris will decide what to do based on an internet blog, then he deserves what comes to him. Let him discuss this with his ruv and decide together what to do without making a public issue about it. <br />After you finished standing up for david morris you can start to stand up for the talmidey chachamim that have been insulted and berated by so many of the bloggers here. Whether you agree or disagree with any of the rabbonim they are all tremendous talmidey chachomim and their honor should be at least as important as david's no matter how highly you hold of him. <br />While david has accomplished a lot for the community, I hardly think that any knowledgable person would say that the rabbanim did less than him for the communityAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-40687399977916133792010-04-27T18:13:23.674+03:002010-04-27T18:13:23.674+03:00I would to send this out for public opinion:
This...I would to send this out for public opinion:<br /><br />This past week David Morris was ridiculed and called deplorable names by the Rav in front of other people before mincha.<br /><br />The only reason that David was in the shul was to attend his halacha shiur (of which he has been a member for 10 years).<br /><br /><br />Now that this travesty and chilul HaShem has been done should David go back this week to attend his "kvias itiim" or stop going all together.<br /><br />Or perhaps the shiur which is a public Kidush HaShem has no place in a shul that allows an upstanding person such as David Morris to be ridiculed without protest.Will There Be Anyone to Stand Up For ME?noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-22104300313386316662010-04-27T16:37:17.709+03:002010-04-27T16:37:17.709+03:00a Hebrew forum discussing the controversy
http://...a Hebrew forum discussing the controversy<br /><br />http://www.bhol.co.il/forum/topic.asp?topic_id=2779212&forum_id=3845<br /><br />according to a poster there it was R. Davidovitz saying the DL-taharas hamishpacha comment to R. Spektor. But, the report is based on hearsay. I find it hard to believe. In fact I know a kippa seruga wearer who asks R. Davidovitz Taharas Hamishpacha sh'eilos.Sick of rumorsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-36499175161426401762010-04-27T16:27:07.259+03:002010-04-27T16:27:07.259+03:00Why won't you identify them?
Don't you thi...Why won't you identify them?<br />Don't you think it is a toeles for the tzibbur to know which rabbonim aren't worth the dandruff on their frock?<br />Furthermore, there is no reason not to identify the DL rabbi who received the comment.<br /><br />Personally, I find it hard to believe that what you say actually happened, but sometimes the truth is stranger than fiction.sick of the rumorsnoreply@blogger.com