tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post115346821744991125..comments2024-03-28T09:43:50.919+02:00Comments on Life in Israel: titles misusedRafi G.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153599721305782842006-07-22T23:22:00.000+03:002006-07-22T23:22:00.000+03:00Yossele - plenty of teachers do not have semicha a...Yossele - plenty of teachers do not have semicha and are qualified to teach and do teach regardless of the no semicha. Semicha is not a requirement for a teacher and never has been. <BR/>I also have no problem with a teacher being called Rav, as he holds a position that requires the respect and deserves the title, regardless of whether or not he has semicha. <BR/>I think gaiva is not really part of it, usually, though it might be sometimes. I do not in my day to day life tell people I have semicha and I do not use the title I earned. People do not call me Rav. I got it because I set a goal for myself and the goal of semicha kept me motivated and focused. I have not used the semicha to earn a position of teaching or in the rabbinate and therefore I have no interest in being called Rav.<BR/>For the short period that I worked in a school as a teacher the students called me Rav and Rabbi, and I accepted it as part of the job. <BR/><BR/>I feel it is an issue of respect. Only certain people deserve the title, either people who received the semicha or people who hold such positions in which the title is appropriate. If it is used freely, it causes a loss of respect for people who do deserve the title.<BR/><BR/>Good luck finding a teaching position. It sounds like your students would really enjoy learning from you Tanach. And thanks for coming in and commenting..Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153598161516322042006-07-22T22:56:00.000+03:002006-07-22T22:56:00.000+03:00I have a passion for Tanach and would love to teac...I have a passion for Tanach and would love to teach it, however I recognise the fact that in order to do this and get jobs I may need smicha. I feel there s nothing particularly disingenuous about this, I feel the title of Rav has changed, people possibly might have to be a little cautious about attaching importance to this title in the future. There is a lot of Gaiva associated with this title, it is strange that the people most likely to deserve the title are those with less gaiva.Yoselehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15854833148007718972noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153595910240810402006-07-22T22:18:00.000+03:002006-07-22T22:18:00.000+03:00Neil -thanks.anon - good idea, but there is no poi...Neil -thanks.<BR/><BR/>anon - good idea, but there is no point in defacing a book just because I disagree with something..<BR/><BR/>social - sounds good<BR/><BR/>Dan - I understand your point. Dr. was an example. I accept your point that there are other uses of Dr. but they all include a qualification. You do not call someone a Dr. just because they teach you something. Your first grade teacher is not called a Dr. There are qualifications for the status.<BR/>I understand you rpoint that they are teaching via the book and therefore possibly deserve the title. However, it is more likely the compilers of the book used the title in order to give the book more legitimacy. In other words, if someone picks up the book in a shul and sees the articles all written by what looks like important Rabbis they are more likely to consider the book respectable and read it, thereby by extension providing the initial institution behind the book a greater level of respect and support. So they are using the titles as a springboard for their own goals..<BR/>Perhaps.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153518194396645432006-07-22T00:43:00.000+03:002006-07-22T00:43:00.000+03:00While I don't completely disagree with your point ...While I don't completely disagree with your point someone should point out that the term Dr. is not researved for those only in the medical field. <BR/><BR/>You should already know that Rafi.<BR/><BR/>Doctor means "a teacher, one who gives instruction in some branch of knowledge, or inculcates opinions or principles."(O.E.D)[1st usage]<BR/><BR/>nowadays the title is researved, but not limited to, those who have recieved a degree such as md or phd or doctorate etc.<BR/><BR/>the point is that there are many ways to achieve an end. The study and effort that these gentlemen applied may have earned them the usage (temporarily on that subject) of the rating of a scholar who can teach, expouse,inculcate information and therefore the readers of the booklet recognize the writers as valued opinions on that issue. <BR/><BR/>PerhapsAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153512115051941852006-07-21T23:01:00.000+03:002006-07-21T23:01:00.000+03:00I agree I wrote that point I think, I just wrote l...I agree I wrote that point I think, I just wrote lots of other babble too lol.socialworker/frustrated momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10352262399235382201noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153495663924966532006-07-21T18:27:00.000+03:002006-07-21T18:27:00.000+03:00Perhaps you should have taken out your pen and cro...Perhaps you should have taken out your pen and cross off 'Harav'?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153489596606201002006-07-21T16:46:00.000+03:002006-07-21T16:46:00.000+03:00I agree, Rafi. The title of Rav/Rabbi is somethin...I agree, Rafi. The title of Rav/Rabbi is something that's earned.Neil Harrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12797772082427806345noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153489175163542972006-07-21T16:39:00.000+03:002006-07-21T16:39:00.000+03:00not talking anout the reason to get semicha. There...not talking anout the reason to get semicha. There can be lots of reasons. One of those is to feel a sense of accomlpishment after spending much time learning the material. A sense of completion.<BR/><BR/>The idea of calling someone Rav when he is not is what disturbs me.. just like in the army you do not call someone a general if he is not, nor an officer if he is not. You do not call someone a doctor if he is not. not a senator if he is not. Not a prince if he is not. Or anything else. The only thing we call people who are not qualified is Rav. Is that how little we respect our Rabbanim, that we use the title so freely?Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153488839211149842006-07-21T16:33:00.000+03:002006-07-21T16:33:00.000+03:00One could be as great without the smicha, but why ...One could be as great without the smicha, but why give the title when one is not a rabbi? It is done all the time in yeshivos. To get smicha for the title is a waste of time. Get it to get the education and be more knowledgeable.socialworker/frustrated momhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10352262399235382201noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153472648257905642006-07-21T12:04:00.000+03:002006-07-21T12:04:00.000+03:00good point. I was not aware of that regarding the ...good point. I was not aware of that regarding the chafetz chaim. I understand there can be a fine line at times... but the chafetz chaim also had a position as Rosh Hayeshiva, which would give him the title regardless...<BR/><BR/>A modern day example would be Rabbi Firer of Ezra Lamarpeh. He is an expert in medical knowledge. Granted he does not practice medicine, only is there for a source of referals and consultations. But would you call him a doctor because he is involved in medicine and has the knowledge? I do not think so. Despite the knowledge, he is not qualified.<BR/><BR/>Excuse me - I am slow. What 2 words are in Rabbanim? Ban (h)im?Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-1153471731432777802006-07-21T11:48:00.000+03:002006-07-21T11:48:00.000+03:00There is really nothing you can do on this one, al...There is really nothing you can do on this one, although I do agree with you 90% of the way.<BR/><BR/>But what do you do about the Chafetz Chaim who never had semicha till his very old age? Would we have called him Mr. Kagan?<BR/><BR/>The line is very grey as to where Reb ends and Rabbi/Rav begins.<BR/><BR/>Also, "Rabbi/Harav" can be used as both a noun, adjective, as well as a professioanl title, which does have some practical difference.<BR/><BR/>And remember - there are 2 words in the word Rabbanim.. :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com