tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post3302807961059306633..comments2024-03-29T11:40:46.477+03:00Comments on Life in Israel: Why did Shas shrink?Rafi G.http://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comBlogger17125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-80238773859239238612009-02-12T10:45:00.000+02:002009-02-12T10:45:00.000+02:00good point eli, that is impressive. I think most o...good point eli, that is impressive. I think most of Likuds seats were picked up from Shas (one or two - shas made up for it with ashkenazy votes), ichud and mafdal, and mostly probably form kadima. Kadima made up for it be taking from labor and meretz.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-48148791860038138552009-02-12T10:34:00.000+02:002009-02-12T10:34:00.000+02:00Despite the fact that Likud picked up 16 seats, Sh...Despite the fact that Likud picked up 16 seats, Shas only lost one. That is impressive.Eli Dukerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10733438132131254422noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-60682322502658205992009-02-12T01:31:00.000+02:002009-02-12T01:31:00.000+02:00Shimon - they are close, but they did go down... O...Shimon - they are close, but they did go down... Of course, soldiers votes that are counted tomorrow might bump them back up to 12... but you also have to take into account the fact that if not for the estimated 8000-10000 votes by ashkenazy haredim who were upset at UTJ, they would probably have dropped to 10 rather than 11.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-26270019445191890342009-02-11T23:22:00.000+02:002009-02-11T23:22:00.000+02:00Tired of the elections??? Not me! It has been grea...Tired of the elections??? Not me! It has been great. We had the US election followed by the local BS election and then the keneset election. Now what am I going to do with myself?<BR/><BR/>Shas has more or less held onto its strength. In the '96 election they polled 10 seats, 11 in 2003 and 12 and 2006.<BR/>The only exception to that rule was 17 in '99 when Deri who was found guilty of corruption ran a very successful campaign on how the whole establishment especially the judiciary system is against the sefardim. Remember, we voted for PM and keneset separately back then so it was easy for traditional sefardim to vote for Bibi and vote for Shas.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-86288951910945797642009-02-11T17:30:00.000+02:002009-02-11T17:30:00.000+02:00The bottom line is that religion and politics just...The bottom line is that religion and politics just don't mix. That doesn't mean that there can't be religious candidates (ie Feiglin and Hotoveli in Likud, Melechoir in Meimad/Labor).<BR/><BR/>But a party built on a religious sector is bound to be problematic..history here has proven this.<BR/><BR/>Personally I would rather see more moral giants like Tzipy Hotoveli and feiglin run in the big parties such as Likud than have the chilulei HaShem in the religious parties.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-48799326931808857592009-02-11T12:59:00.000+02:002009-02-11T12:59:00.000+02:00I think that the answer is more basic that what yo...I think that the answer is more basic that what you wrote: IMO the era of sectorial parties, including religious parties, is coming to an end. All of the dati parties lost seats.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-82738381375338006102009-02-11T11:56:00.000+02:002009-02-11T11:56:00.000+02:00Mr Srbs - you are forgetting that whoever forms a ...Mr Srbs - you are forgetting that whoever forms a coalition will still be a minority in the government. That's whats so surreal about the whole situation. How can someone with 25% of the voters backing be primeminister? If it wasn't so sad I would laughAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-575736703237433162009-02-11T11:27:00.000+02:002009-02-11T11:27:00.000+02:00anon, you might be right. am too depressed to get ...anon, you might be right. am too depressed to get excited about that.<BR/><BR/>The bottom line is that if those votes would have been cast for likud, then we would not be in this situation.<BR/><BR/>Likud is not perfect. Perfection is the enemy of the good...that's why I voted Likud.<BR/><BR/>Even if Likud forms a coalition, they will be a minority in their own government. That's never good. Once again, that's why I said the small right wing parties are a total waste...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-43765494491254666502009-02-11T11:08:00.000+02:002009-02-11T11:08:00.000+02:00I think the average Shas voter doesn't read this b...I think the average Shas voter doesn't read this blog, yaak... but you never know!<BR/><BR/>It is possible, but I think the ones who returned to Likud did so more because they feel out of sync with Shas...Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-54600345590000933152009-02-11T11:06:00.000+02:002009-02-11T11:06:00.000+02:00I forgot to add 2 more points:Some Shas voters wer...I forgot to add 2 more points:<BR/><BR/>Some Shas voters were voting Lieberman this time for some odd reason, thus prompting the Rav Ovadia and Baba Baruch videos against Lieberman.<BR/><BR/>Also, some Shas voters I'm sure heeded Rafi's rallying cry to vote Likud as an anti-Livni protest vote.yaakhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08179304707239865515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-81406906931856134202009-02-11T10:56:00.000+02:002009-02-11T10:56:00.000+02:00Yes, partially from what you said - the perception...Yes, partially from what you said - the perception of it being a hareidi-only party. They tried to counter that perception with articles like <A HREF="http://www.shas.org.il/node/433" REL="nofollow">this</A> on their website, but it was not enough.<BR/><BR/>Secondly, some ashkenazi hareidim decided to back National Union instead of Shas, since Ketzaleh built up many Hareidi settlements in Yehuda and Shomron and an overall admiration of Ketzaleh.<BR/><BR/>Thirdly, Shas's message that they want to be perceived as a right-wing party is not being transfered to the media, so some people wrongly think that they have left-leaning tendencies.<BR/><BR/>Finally, there is still some anti-sephardi bias going on unfortunately.yaakhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08179304707239865515noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-63369315387473182992009-02-11T10:18:00.000+02:002009-02-11T10:18:00.000+02:00"and I am sure you are to"should read"and I am sur..."and I am sure you are to"<BR/>should read<BR/>"and I am sure you are too"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-87449244801945015392009-02-11T09:57:00.000+02:002009-02-11T09:57:00.000+02:00mrsrbs, whoa! slow down there a sec.a) it is not c...mrsrbs, whoa! slow down there a sec.<BR/><BR/>a) it is not clear if Livni can form a coalition.<BR/><BR/>b) if she does Netanyahu is in it. or Lieberman.<BR/><BR/>so I am not sure if that is as bad as a netanyahu led gov't comprised of Kadima and Avoda which as past performance while not guranteeing future results is a pretty good indicator that such a gov't will not take any of the strong stands needed and rockets will continue unchekced, Iran getys the bnomb unchecked, etc,etc,<BR/><BR/>Since Netanyahu might be forced to choose a right wing gov't witht he right wing parties totaslly uninfluenced by Kadima or Avida the gov't miht actually be right wing. Of course the Haredim wil need to be thrown their bones and that is somethign we will just have to swallow.<BR/><BR/>But lt us daven and see how things play out. It could be very good.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-39394301936795493752009-02-11T09:49:00.000+02:002009-02-11T09:49:00.000+02:00. . .either that or UTJ should stop acting like bl.... . .either that or UTJ should stop acting like blogger heads and have a bit of achdus Yisroel in them. If the two parties were combined they would firstly have garnered (at the present count)16 seats, and secondly may have caused others from defecting when they see how the Hareidim are actually working together.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-33843124555972102562009-02-11T09:43:00.000+02:002009-02-11T09:43:00.000+02:00anon - corrected. thanks for catching it. that is ...anon - corrected. thanks for catching it. that is what I meant.Rafi G.https://www.blogger.com/profile/00699851287106903971noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-36373420545106037312009-02-11T09:33:00.000+02:002009-02-11T09:33:00.000+02:00i completely agree. this was the consensus in my h...i completely agree. this was the consensus in my house last night....<BR/><BR/>also, what a waste of all the small right wing party votes....they totally gave the election away!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20257999.post-89290201569822072712009-02-11T09:27:00.000+02:002009-02-11T09:27:00.000+02:00"They would do themselves a favor and head back to..."They would do themselves a favor and head back to the traditional voter they used to appeal to, and only dabble in the haredi aspect of their party... if they want to get big again"<BR/><BR/>I think you meant to say "and NOT ONLY dabble in the haredi aspect of their party... if they want to get big again"<BR/><BR/>If so, point well taken.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com