Due to the false claims that Israel is trying to change the status quo on Har Habayit and therefore the Arabs justify killing people, the media is non-stop talking about those who go up to Har Habayit as provoking terror.
This has caused the Elboim family, a large Haredi family of Belzer hassidim who all go up regularly, to become the target of Haredi protests and attacks. The Neturei Karta have been protesting outside houses of family members of the Elboim family. Askanim have been making moves within the hassidus to pressure the Elboims to stop going up, It has even come to the point that Elboims have been physically attacked, in addition to verbal abuse.To get to the point, the Belzer Rebbe has come to a decision, supposedly, that unless the Elboims stop, they will be thrown out of the hassidus and everything that entails, such as their children will be thrown out of the schools, and they will be thrown out of all the Belz mosdos.
source: Kooker (at this link you can hear a radio interview with Elboim about this) , Bechadrei and Kikar
for years the Elboims have been going up almost daily. Until now, the Rebbe has refused to tell the Elboims to stop, despite the Rebbe making his public proclamations as to the prohibition of going up to Har Habayit. Suddenly the Rebbe will throw Elboim out for going up? This reeks of askanim forcing daas torah according to their wishes rather than actual daas torah.
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It also reeks of Issurei D'ohreisa, but I understand Charedim don't care much about those.
ReplyDeletewhat reeks of issurei deoraisa? i can read your comment to be referring to any of a few options...
DeletePhysical attacks and verbal abuse.
DeleteWhy do you presume that the change of heart was by the askanim? Perhaps the Rebbe himself changed his mind?
ReplyDeleteif the rebbe changed his mind now just because of a media blitz and some Arab lies (about Israel trying to change the status quo - even if Elboim is, even if I would like it to be true, the State is not tryign to change any status quo, and nothiogn up there was changed to the benefit of the Jews), that is even more upsetting and disconcerting
DeleteRafi, perhaps the issue is that before it wasn't a Chillul Hashem B'rabim and now that it is in the media it is. I'm saying that from their perspective. I'm not taking sides.
ReplyDeletethat is certainly an option. I only said it reeks of it, not it is definite.
Deletestill, considering that his connection to har habayit has been in the news many times before, I dont think anything now turns it into a chilul hashem more than it would have been a chilul hashem until now. The possibility I see is that it now possibly embarrasses the hassidus and the rebbe so they have reason to stop him and even threaten him because of that. that isnt halachic or daas torah either, but it would be a valid reason. if that were the case, I would hope the rebbe had told him to please stop until things quiet down so as not to put him (ie the rebbe and maybe the entire belz) in a precarious situation - maybe he did, and maybe Elboim refused, so it came to this
Yep. Askanim can bring the "righteous rage" to the Rebbe , but it's up to the Rebbe whether to act on it. Its hard to say you're a Chassid if you don't play by the Rebbe's rules.
DeleteI think we all suffer from daas askonim. What on earth is daas Torah?
ReplyDelete