Perhaps some background about how/why shuls are associated with certain 'competing' gmachs?

I dont think it was anything more than natural evolution. Lemaan Achai has always been considered more dati leumi, because its founder is, even though they help everyone regardless of kipa. and because there approach is not the standard haredi type of approach of distributing money to everyone who needs, but evaluating a persons needs and trying to help them through the crisis with things other than just money. The Kupa was always perceived as being a haredi organization, because its founders and managers are haredi. Shuls sort of went along those lines, but usually LA associated shuls respect Kupa, and Kupa associated shuls usually respect LA collectors. This shul in particular is an extreme exception in that they let every Joe collect for whatever except LA collectors.

Perhaps someone else can fill in details if there is something more specific in the history that I am missing.

It's not the first time; there was a recording about a year ago of a Lemaan Achai representative being thrown out of Maasas Mordechai. At the time, the recording was posted, but taken down shortly afterward. Perhaps David will post that one as well (being in English, it might be more meaningful to many of the local residents).

Maasas Mordechai is indeed open to anyone who wants to daven there. Of course, one cannot be a chazan if they (a) do not wear a hat and jacket (b) shave during sefira (c) daven in an accent other than Ashkenozis or (d) are named Natan Slifkin. But you can still join any minyan!

There is a lot more history to this, and perhaps you might invite David to fill it in, because if he hasn't said it publicly, then I don't feel I should. What is public knowledge, however, is that the Kupa existed before Lemaan Achai, and David Morris used to be one the board of the Kupa. David - you want to fill in the blanks?

if I am not mistaken, the Kupa did not exist then either. it was called something else at the time. both the Kupa and LA, again - if I am not mistaken in my recollection, were formed after that original organization...

I daven at KSY where both the Rav and shul president are very (to say the least) involved in Lema'an Achai.

There is a healthy presence of both organizations in the shul and the president himself will often mention the Kupa in spite of his strong Lema'an Achai connection.
Sadly our kehilla is an exception and not the rule for most Charedi shuls in RBS.

I am a part of the Charedi community, have sent my kids to Charedi schools and learn in one of the Anglo Charedi Baalei batim kollelim.

There is no question that in the Charedi community there is a bias against Lema'an Achai and most people don't even know why.

It is sad that an organizations that is doing so much for our community are prevented from doing even more due to prejudice on the part of an uninformed (or misinformed) sector of the population.

Fact: Many hareidi shuls in RBS unofficially ban Lema'an Achai.

They will take down Lema'an Achai posters, dump LA literature, disappear Lem'an Achai kupot - and their rabbonim will activey discourage donors from contributing to Lema'an Achai.

The main two exceptions, which have *official* bans, are Masas Mordechai and Beis Tefilla.

Perhaps MM and BT are simply more honest about their shul's policies than the others - and if so, what's wrong with that?

to the best of my knowledge. BTYA has never stopped anyone from collecting, nor have they thrown out anyone who was doing so. They dont allow LA posters and announcements for them are not made, but I am not aware of an official ban on collectors. I rarely daven there during the week, but I have never heard of a LA collector being stopped and told to leave. As a matter of fact, at least a couple times of year, by the holidays, I have seen both LA tzedaka boxes on the bima and collectors collecting. i have even been one of those collectors.

I couldn't make out what was being said in the video... can anyone tell me?

there is a community in rbs a that has 35 families supported by lemaan achai, have there own tsedaka organization but will not let lemaan achai make appeals, put up posters, or help in any way, and at the same time 35 families are supported by them. crazy!

Is it just me or is there something wrong here.

It is the year 2013/5773 and we live in a supposedly open, educated community that tolerates such behavior toward a tzedaka organization?

What makes this particular story even more sickening is that Rabbi Benedict is not just the Kupa gabbai in Masaas Mordechai. I know that he is very involved in many aspects of the Kupa Shel Tzedaka.

The fact that the Kupa tolerates such behavior from one of their own is as intolerable as the bans themselves.

Why is it that one can go into any part of RBSA and see Kupa signs but there are many areas where Lema'an Achai signs aren't allowed (or are ripped down after being put up)?

We can't blame this on a "few crazies" when it seems to be a policy condoned by many kehilos and even some rabbonim.

Perhaps during sefira as we mourn the deaths of R' Akiva's talmidim due to "lo nahago kavod" we can work on this midas Sdom in our own midst.

These "protective measures" usually only work in reverse - for example since we've seen the flare-ups of anti-LA behavior from the Kupa (which included an offensive ad campaign several years ago, and still includes the informal incidents mentioned above), personally our tzedakah has shifted almost entirely to LA vs. the 50-50 it used to be. We figure we need to do what we can to counter their anti-campaign.

It is a shame, because both organizations have policies to help any people who need it, according to separate criteria of need and potential to help. Further, field experience elsewhere shows that the more that people are encouraged to give tzedakah - the more they give to all the opportunities (i.e. it isn't really a limited pocket if you get the givers in a positive frame of mind).

I don't know what it means when you say "Many/some families from Masas Mordechai receive assistance from Lema'an Achai." This is just an attempt to make Benedict look worse.

As someone who has some (limited) involvement in MM, I can tell you that there is no shul membership, there are no shul 'members' and there is no such thing as a typical MM shul goer (this includes on shabbat and yom tov). Probably half of the rama (an exaggeration I admit but you get the picture) davens in MM at least once or twice a week (and probably 0.01% of those davening there make any contribution but that is a different story) and almost everyone has a different shul where they are a member. So how does anyone identify a 'MM family'.

I had heard in the past that MM did not have a large membership, but I figured that was relative to how many people actually daven there.

Personally, in my nearly 14 years in RBS I can only recall davening in MM once.

If membership is as non-existent as you say, and if only .01% of daveners donate money, how does MM survive? who pays the bills, be it electricity, water, cleaning or maintenance or anything else?

even without a significant membership, mm must have plenty of regulars who despite not paying anything would be considered de facto members and mm families

Anon of 8:31:

First of all Benedict doesn't need anything more to make him look worse. He is obviously a thug.

I know of plenty of people who daven at MM "kavua" so yes, there is a great possibility that Lema'an Achai is helping families that daven at MM.

Please don't try and whitewash a clear avla on the part of MM and their leadership.

I am anon from 8:31.

Not an attempt to whitewash. IMHO Benedict was wrong, but I don't think it deserved posting on you-tube or some of the vitriol here. I guess that Benedict wasn't to know that the no.1 issue on Rafi's blog was lemaan achai/magen vs Kupa vs R Malinowitz - maybe he would have been given this more thought had he known.

FYI - MM has no membership and no priority for yamim noraim. Many years ago it had a building fund - but this is now basically redundant. There are a very small number of people keeping things afloat (relative to any shul in the rama), with occasional decent donations from visitors/guests from out of town. The vast majority of the 'kavua' daveners at MM do not contribute regularly or significantly and they also have other shuls where they hold membership (whether it be at Ramat Shalom/Mercazi or Kehillas Yaakov/Chanichei, given the diversity of the 'kavua' daveners). I'm sure benedict could confirm this.

Practically speaking - aside from reasonable people being horrified and then getting back to their other business - what can be done to change this policy at MM?

Robert - that's a very appropriate question, and enough to get me out of "lurking" mode.

Last time something like this happened - the anti-LA "whispering" campaign a few years ago - I wrote directly to the directors of the Kupa saying that their silence appears in the eyes of the community as complicity in the loshon hora that was being spread against Lemaan Achai. I requested them to post a public clarification that they had nothing to do with the rumors, and a public endorsement of the good work that LA does for the community. Much to my delight, they actually did so.

Perhaps the time has come for the community to target the Kupa board and get them to post a similar protest against shuls who refuse to let LA collect there. Bring to their attention the fact that one of their reps in MM has been acting in conflict of interests and refusing to allow LA to collect in MM, and have them censure him and declare that they will have no part in any blackballing of other tzedaka organizations. Let's even shoot higher: request that the Kupa declare that they will not put their pushkas in any shul that refuses to allow LA to collect there.

Thoughts?

Shaul,

A few points to consider:

1) Benedict is not just the Kupa rep of MM..he is a major player in the Kupa.

2) From time to time I daven in Biale (Rav Stavsky). There is no Lema'an Achai presence there either. I asked why and was told that it isn't kavod to have any Lema'an Achai presence in the shul where Rabbi Eidensohn from the Kupa davens. I don't know where Rabbi Leventhal of Lema'an Achai davens but I can't imagine that his shul is devoid of the Kupa.

3) Many of the people behind the anti-LA actions are the very rabbonim and leaders that guide the Kupa. Perhaps we have to ask ourselves that despite their good work, does the Kupa represent hashkafos that will turn RBSA into another RBSB or Kirya HaCharedi?

2. if I am not mistaken, Rabbi Leventhal davens at KSY, which as already stated, has a Kupa presence.

Lurking Shaul B - sounds like a plan!

If the kupa leadership would take such a stand for tolerance and mutual respect, then this would move our whole community forward.

I just looked up my old correspondence (gotta love Gmail!) and found an email thread from Feb 2008 between me and David Greenwald. The people running the Kupa are very decent folks who probably just need a gentle, respectful nudge in the direction of shalom to wake up and say, "Hey, that's a great idea to increase shalom in the community!" His email is ddd1 at neto.bezeqint.net, and the general Kupa email is rbstzedaka at gmail.com.

Please write to them, and in your own words, express your dismay at the fact that an official of the Kupa was caught, on camera, preventing Lemaan Achai from collecting at MM. Ask them please to post a public clarification of their respect for LA, and a statement of goodwill calling on all shuls that have Kupa pushkas also to allow Lemaan Achai to collect there.

I think the effective part of your plan was obtaining a Kuppa commitment not to collect in shuls which ban Lema'an Achai.

Otherwise, the fine people at the Kupa will simply write a rousing email, and the situation will remain the current status quo. (As it did in 2008, right?)

also asking kupa to kick out benedict and anyone else in the kupa that behaves similarly, should also be asked of them

Here's what I wrote to the Kupa. If you want to write to them too, feel free to borrow the ideas, but please don't copy the text; that would undermine the sincerity of the letter - unless you want to quote it in my name and say that you agree.

(BTW the address I posted above for David Greenwald bounced, so don't bother with it.)

---

Honored representatives of the RBS Kupa shel Tzedaka,
(CC: Avrohom Leventhal, David Morris)

I salute you for all the outstanding work you do for the RBS community!
At the same time, I feel I must bring to your attention the unfortunate fact that several people, perhaps feeling they are acting in the interests of the Kupa, have been acting in a way that I am sure the Kupa would not appreciate. Most recently, a couple of days ago a Kupa official in Masas Mordechai (R' Benedict) was recorded publicly refusing to allow a representative of Lemaan Achai to collect there, even though that Beis Midrash allows all other individuals and organizations to make appeals there.
Unfortunately this is not a freak occurrence. There are many other shuls and batei midrash in RBS who, officially or unofficially, do not allow Lemaan Achai to collect there, and where any Lemaan Achai posters, pushkas or other material are summarily torn down, removed and otherwise damaged.
I am not a representative of Lemaan Achai, and I donate money to both these wonderful tzedakos; and it breaks my heart to see Jews acting in such a way.
From my past correspondences with you, I am very aware that you are people of great integrity and ehrlichkeit, and such actions are not ח"ו incited or condoned by your organization.
The reason why I am bringing this to your attention is because I believe the people who are behind these acts of sabotage have rationalized in some perverse way that they are thereby supporting the cause of the Kupa, as if Lemaan Achai were some kind of adversary to be defeated.
I therefore respectfully suggest that the Kupa post a public statement, as you did in February 2008 (and I still have the email to prove it!), to the effect that the Kupa and Lemaan Achai are ideologically aligned in supporting the needy of RBS-A, condemning the obstruction of Lemaan Achai collectors and the sabotage of their material, and calling on all shuls who support the Kupa also to allow Lemaan Achai to raise funds there unhindered.
Especially in this period of sefiras haomer, when we are enjoined to be particularly careful about acting with mutual respect, I believe this would be a tremendous boost to Shalom in our beautiful neighborhood, and a source of unimaginable zechuyos to Klal Yisroel.

Tizku lemitzvos!

Bivracha,
Shaul B

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Shaul B,

I commend you for your idea and call to action.

In all due respect, however,with regard to the Kupa and the people who run it the wonderful sincere people like you are the problem, not the solution.

In your letter you wrote: "I am not a representative of Lemaan Achai, and I donate money to both these wonderful tzedakos; and it breaks my heart to see Jews acting in such a way."

The Kupa knows well that no matter how they act or what they say you will continue to support them. Therefore they can make empty statements and swear how they respect Lema'an Achai, yadda, yadda and the sweet sincere LA supporters will support them as well.

They also know that no matter how much good work Lema'an Achai does and how many "peaceful" statements are made, their core supporters will never give to Lema'an Achai seriously.

This is why you will find Kupa posters and reps in LA "type" of shuls but not vice versa.

The only true way to influence is to strengthen Lema'an Achai so that they can continue to help so many in our community.

In my very humble opinion this subject goes way beyond a Lema'an Achai collector being shoved out of MM.

This issue is indicative of the attitude that some in the Charedi world have about those not like them and the struggle for power and control.

This is the same struggle for who should be Chief Rabbi, who should run mikvaos,who should be in the coalition and the list goes on.

If Lema'an Achai will be marginalized by these effective "bans", the Kupa will have more power and control in the neighborhood.

If the Kupa people and their Rabbonim were truly interested in only helping others it wouldn't matter if Lema'an Achai would come in to collect in their shuls. They wouldn't plaster our city with advertising..they would channel efforts in working together for the good of everyone.

Rafi, I believe that this posting should receive more prominence on your blog as it is at the very core of what divides us both here in RBS and across the nation in general.

Rafi - given the interest & constructive ideas this posting has generated, how about bumping it up to the top of the blog?