Sorry Rafi- you're kidding yourself.

BS will be totally Haredi in 10 years.

Tell me - if the identities of the guys are really known, why wouldn't those in the know actually do something about it (whether that would be to go to the police, their parents, their yeshivas... or take matters into their own hands)?

My guess is that they have no clue who did it. They figure that mima nafshach - the guys who did it can't go around and gloat that the initials on the pashkavil are wrong; and those who don't know who did it might get scared into not trying anything similar in the future.

Either way, I don't think this "warning" will be taken seriously.

I disagree, Jeremy. While I agree the percentage of Haredi vs. non- Haredi will grow in the haredi favor, it will not become completely, or even close to completely, haredi. You can't just chase out 50,000 residents, many of whom have been in Bet Shemesh for between 15 and 50 years.

Bet Shemesh is more like Jerusalem. A mixed city with an increasing haredi population. Rather than being like Kiryat sefer or beitar.

Glad to see that there is a response, but 2 questions:

- Was any action taken directly against the individuals via police, parents, rabbonim, schools etc,

- Why was the notice not signed? I would have hoped that the important rabbonim in the area would have been lining up to add their name to a notice like this.

The pashkevill was put out by the people in Sheinfeld/Aviv.

It looks like the partnership between them and the Gerer chasidim has borne fruit.

The ringleader is Chaim Heimlich, Hayarden 8, Tel.
02-9921886.

Modi'in anyone?

This is why I am scared to purchase a home in RBS.

Friday night there was a "mishmar" out between 8-12. it was mostly quiet. a number of gold-striped chasidim were paying attention (not knowing what was being planned - b/c ynet reported that a revenge was planned: http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-3641209,00.html). I don't know if anything will be accomplished, but at least they know the anglos won't "turn the other cheek" forever.

Jeremy said...

"BS will be totally Haredi in 10 years."

Haredi already is "BS" :), but I don't think that BS will be totally Haredi.

"The ringleader is Chaim Heimlich, Hayarden 8, Tel.
02-9921886"

And let's not forget that certain individuals in our own community have a kesher with this Heimlich and his tzedaka organization.

Really? Who and how?

I am sure the kannoim will be more than happy to fight, as they have done many times in the past, for what they believe the neighborhood should look like, and what they think should and should not be allowed.

This sign will not stop anything.

But it is a good start. It shows the community is starting to fight back and not take it sitting down any longer. This is only the beginning. I don't know what the next steps will be, but I imagine a full outing might be next, and then it could go anywhere once everyone knows the identities.

All the Bet Shemesh papers (except for the haredi Chadash) ran the story in full detail. The pressure on the police and the mayor to resolve this situation is going to be tremendous, and with every further incident it will become that much greater. Eventually, somehow, it will be put to an end or escalate into serious fights.

"The tragedy is that none of this has to happen. In my opinion, if the mayor called a meeting with the most radical of the rabbis and told them that he will personally make sure that their schools’ discretionary funding will be cut, that the police will be scrutinizing their shuls and yeshivot for violations, that, quite frankly, he will make sure that the municipality does everything to make life difficult for them, they will eventually cave in."

http://www.5tjt.com/news/read.asp?Id=3561

RBSer...

As reported here on the blog a new Kupa Tzedaka was open to benefit these kannoim last winter. The guest speaker (and supporter) was Rav Shmuel Z. Eidensohn.

His response when asked why he supports such kannoim was

"to keep RBS (a and B) from becoming too modern".

It is people such as he and Rabbis Kornfeld and Perlstein who wish to make this another Betar or Kiryat Sefer.

Anon,

<SARCASM>
Sure - chareidim have a long history of caving in to police and government actions (once the mayor threatens them, it's not clear if it will take the konoim days or merely hours to declare that he is not really chareidi).
</SARCASM>

To Chareidi-

R' Eidenson denies it.

R' Eidenson denies it."

Denies what? That he spoke for them? That was public knowledge.

That he said what he did about too modern? Why does he deny it now when it was on the net many months ago (and he didn't deny it then")?

Please refer to:

http://lifeinisrael.blogspot.com/2008/02/giving-legitimacy-to-hooligans.html

He denied it then too.
I heard it then.

clarification-
He did speak.
He denies that he gave that explanation.
I heard the denial soon after the accusation.
I didn't post it then because I didn't want to bring it back to life.
Now that I see someone bringing it up again I mentioned the denial.

Now , not only does he deny it,
.
But people who know him well say that (without speaking to him) that it couldn't be true because it is so out of character for him.

In general he doesn't defend himself on blogs.

Please stop repeating this.

It's a shame that he is always so misunderstood and misquoted that he would even have to defend himself on a blog.

"It's a shame that he is always so misunderstood and misquoted that he would even have to defend himself on a blog."

"But people who know him well say that (without speaking to him) that it couldn't be true because it is so out of character for him."

Perhaps he should stop associating with organizations and people who represnet the fringes of our community.

"V"hisem nkiim"

Is there any truth to the Rumor that Rav Chiam Soloveichik and His Older Sons Have started Carrying Automatic Weapons and Assault Rifles in An effort to Protect the Shul and The Community from a gang of Chareidi Thugs. If so where do I sign Up. I have never seen a case where physical abuse has been stoped by letters.

SlapsyMaxy

"Is there any truth to the Rumor that Rav Chiam Soloveichik and His Older Sons Have started Carrying Automatic Weapons and Assault Rifles in An effort to Protect the Shul and The Community from a gang of Chareidi Thugs."

Just becuase the Charedi thugs and their rabbonim (yes even some here in RBSA) don't consider Rav Chaim "daas Torah" doesn't mean he'll have to carry weapons.

Perhaps he'll only have to carry towels to wipe off the eggs and dirty diapers thrown at him.

It amazes me how a Talmid Chochum with backbone poses such a threat to the Charedi establishment.

Save RBSA-
"Perhaps he'll only have to carry towels to wipe off the eggs and dirty diapers thrown at him.

It amazes me how a Talmid Chochum with backbone poses such a threat to the Charedi establishment."

When are you going to stop beating your wife?....
Perhaps we'll have to....

Anon of 10:27-

Refuah Shleima!

Does Rav Chaim's backbone also threaten you?

No offense but seriously,
What backbone?

Rav Chaim is a great guy but other than refuting non-existent rumors what has he stood up against?

I see him more as a leader for his congregants.

A Realistic Fan

What backbone?

He openly challenged the disgrace of protecting child molesters among us.
He openly discussed what is Daas Torah and what are the daos of Torah.
He defended the right of the Rabbanut to have shlita over the new mikve on Dolev.
He openly supports Lema'an Achai (eventhough some Rabbonim won't)- one of the greatest tzedaka and chesed organization in the Rama.

He does these things with no consideration to his critics (or what shidduchim his kids will get because of it).

More power to him!

This is Realistic Fan-
I stand corrected.
Thank you.

I am relativley new to this area but I have seen this Lemaán Achai issue brought up many times.

Could someone out there (perhaps from the Kupa side) please explain why there is any reason not to support Lemaán Achai?

They seem to do amazing work, help anyone in need and have Rabbinic guidance.

Why can't Charedim support them as well as the Kupa?