Sep 8, 2015
Interesting Psak: It isn't necessarily a duck. or a chicken
If it looks like a duck and quacks like a duck, it is probably a duck.
But not necessarily.
Rav Mahfoud goes on an annual visit to Rav Chaim Kanievsky to pay his respects before Rosh Hashana and to discuss the latest kashrus questions that have been raised within his kashrus organization.
This time another visitor tagged along with Rav Mahfoud.
A chicken.
But not just any chicken. A new chicken. A chicken with no feathers.
This featherless chicken was recently developed to grow like this, along with some other alterations.
The ancestor oof this strain of chicken was a strain of chicken that was developed over 100 years ago and is more red in color. The rabbonim of 100 years ago already paskened that that chicken is muttar to be eaten and is included in the "tradition" we have for chickens.
This new chicken is a grandbaby of that chicken, but altered further to also grow without feathers.
It also turns out that somehow this chicken is sturdier than your average chicken. It has less health issues, less treifa problems, less problems with the sinews in the legs, and can handle the heat better.
Rav Mahfoud brought along the chicken to ask Rav Kanievsky:
1. Is this called the skin having peeled, which is a treifa, or is this ok because it grew like this?
2. is this included in the tradition or not, and are we allowed to alter chickens to grow differently than the traditional way?
Rav Kanievsky paskened that we should not alter chickens away from their traditional way of growing, and even if it looks like a chicken in every other way, we cannot accept it as acceptable within the tradition of kosher fowl.
source: Ladaat
I don't know why he said we are not allowed to make alterations from the traditional appearance of a chicken. I can follow saying an altered chicken is not included in the tradition, but we alter all sorts of things with our food and farm sciences nowadays - some might be kosher and some might not be because of those alterations. I would have liked some additional explanation as to why this is not included in the tradition, and more so why are we not allowed to alter chickens from their traditional appearance.
But not necessarily.
Rav Mahfoud goes on an annual visit to Rav Chaim Kanievsky to pay his respects before Rosh Hashana and to discuss the latest kashrus questions that have been raised within his kashrus organization.
This time another visitor tagged along with Rav Mahfoud.
A chicken.But not just any chicken. A new chicken. A chicken with no feathers.
This featherless chicken was recently developed to grow like this, along with some other alterations.
The ancestor oof this strain of chicken was a strain of chicken that was developed over 100 years ago and is more red in color. The rabbonim of 100 years ago already paskened that that chicken is muttar to be eaten and is included in the "tradition" we have for chickens.
This new chicken is a grandbaby of that chicken, but altered further to also grow without feathers.
It also turns out that somehow this chicken is sturdier than your average chicken. It has less health issues, less treifa problems, less problems with the sinews in the legs, and can handle the heat better.
Rav Mahfoud brought along the chicken to ask Rav Kanievsky:
1. Is this called the skin having peeled, which is a treifa, or is this ok because it grew like this?
2. is this included in the tradition or not, and are we allowed to alter chickens to grow differently than the traditional way?
Rav Kanievsky paskened that we should not alter chickens away from their traditional way of growing, and even if it looks like a chicken in every other way, we cannot accept it as acceptable within the tradition of kosher fowl.
source: Ladaat
I don't know why he said we are not allowed to make alterations from the traditional appearance of a chicken. I can follow saying an altered chicken is not included in the tradition, but we alter all sorts of things with our food and farm sciences nowadays - some might be kosher and some might not be because of those alterations. I would have liked some additional explanation as to why this is not included in the tradition, and more so why are we not allowed to alter chickens from their traditional appearance.
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I think the word choice of "traditional" is not quite right. It's like saying that if the Sun rises tomorrow and is the color blue, that it's not the Sun.
ReplyDeleteSince when is animal husbandry a "tradition"? If it was breeded from known stock, without kil'ayim, why should there be a problem?
ReplyDeleteBesides, how long has the "tradition" of raising and eating chicken been around, anyway? There is archaeological evidence that it was first brought to these regions during the Second Temple period, so there surely was no tradition before that...
regarding point 1, thats what made the psak so strange.
Deleteregarding point 2 - from bayis sheni until today has been nearly a couple thousand years. thats plenty enough time for a tradition to form!
I've worked with poultry and the chickens are already definitely being grown away from tradition in order to A) be able to pack more into the coops B) grow larger and faster than natural C) trying to strengthen the legs to be able to endure the extra unnatural weight.
ReplyDeleteSo, maybe, according to Rav Chaim, those as well are ossur.
Delete(Yes, I know this means ALL poultry.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2YRDFXQB37s
ReplyDeleteThe chickens were bred through natural selection. using only kosher birds.
No genetic engineering.
No intermixing with non-kosher species.
They started with a bird that had been born that way, due to a natural mutation.
Why in the world should that render it non-kosher?
EVERY commercial chicken got that way through selective breeding!
How a Jewish Legend Can Help Us Navigate the Biotech Century https://books.google.ca/books?id=QeLbAAAAMAAJ&focus=searchwithinvolume&q=chicken
ReplyDeleteFor a halachic analysis, see: http://goo.gl/c6Izdq
ReplyDelete