Aug 20, 2007

Serving his Jewish Country

Read the interesting story and emotions of parents (mine) of a volunteer IDF soldier (my brother), as printed in the Chicago Jewish News.

There are some minor inaccuracies in the article, but overall it is well-written. The inaccuracies do not really change anything in the story....


  1. Cool article.

    Is he holding a MAG?

  2. dont remember and I cant see the pic well enough. He has plenty of pics with the MAG though

  3. very nice. I am glad your brother found his place. I can imagine your parents emotions.

    Good that he has family (you) in Israel

  4. that paragraph toward the end about neighbors not really caring about him was pretty depressing.

    so what are you going to do now to compete with your brother's fame?

  5. I do not know why that is. I always find such stories fascinating... and if I knew someone whose kid was in the army, I would always be concerned and curious as how that child was doing...

  6. As an American it really bothers me when I hear stories like this.

    An US citizen should only join the US Military.

    This dual citizenship thing is wrong. It is why so many Americans question the loyalty of American Jews.

    Hey, got to be fair. I would say the same thing about any US citizen who would go overseas and fight for another military regardless of what the other military was.

  7. First, he says, "there aren't many people born and raised in one country who feel a homeland affinity to another country as well as their own country.

    Unfortunately that just isn't true these days in America. It is why I don't only mistrust Jews because of their so called "dual citizenship" but naturalized citizens.

    Citizenship means you should only have loyalty to the country you are a citizen of.

  8. "In addition, he says, "in terms of patriotism, there's a level of patriotism involved with America too."

    "a level"? If you can't love America without your whole heart and sole then you should respectfully renounce your US citizenship.

    I have posted that in many groups not just Jewish ones. I say that to any US citizen who feels any loyalty to any other country. A US citizen should only be loyal to America and since serving in the Armed Forces is the ultimate act of loyalty, any US citizen who serves in any military that isn't the US military is a traitor and at the very least should renounce their US citizenship before applying to serve in the foreign military.

  9. If you can't love America with your whole heart and soul then you should respectfully renounce your US citizenship.

    Sorry I have posted so many times but stories like these really make me angry.

    Dual citizenship is really an oxymoron. In your heart one citizenship is always favored and the other one is always used in behalf of the favored on.

    It is dishonest.

    Ok, this guy has made his choice, his loyalty to Israel is stronger than his loyalty to America. I can respect that. But I can only respect that as long as he now does the decent thing and politely renounce his US citizenship.

  10. I hear you steve. But, for some reason, America is a country, and while maybe not unique it is not so common, that allows dual citizenship. It is exactly that freedom that makes America so great and strong.

    Aside from that, the person in question is not a citizen of Israel, just a volunteer in the army. People do such things for all sorts of reasons. In World War 2 many American citizens volunteered to fight in foreign armies prior to America entering the war. It happens all the time for all sorts of reasons. It does not mean someone is not or less patriotic.

  11. I thought the guy was a Israeli citizen. Well that's a little bit worse. He is a traitor and should seek Israeli citizenship and renounce his US citizenship a soon as possible.

    In World War 2 many American citizens volunteered to fight in foreign armies prior to America entering the war and I haven't totally reconciled my feelings about those people. For many they were doing it not because they were patriotic to the country they were fighting with but because they believed that the enemy was the enemy of the US as well and this was the ONLY way they could at the time fight it. So they were doing it because of their patriotism of America.

    But that said, to be fair, they probably should have waited until the US actually got into the war, so yeah, when all is said and done they were wrong in what they did regardless of their intentions.

    But again, they joined a foreign military because they had no other way to fight the enemy. We are fighting the enemy right now and so this guy did have the option of joining the US military to fight the enemy, which he didn't do.

    So, yeah, he is a traitor and should renounce his US citizenship if he wants to be honest and not deceitful about what is really in his heart. He is no American!

  12. "...that freedom that makes America so great and strong."


    We are hanging together by a thread here.

    Diversity is perversity and Political Correctness is killing us as a country.

  13. I guess you are entitled to that opinion, but it seems that the law/many people think differently.

    The enemy he chose to fight is a different one than the one America chose to fight. I do not want to get involved in a discussion of the justification or lack thereof of the war on iraq, but maybe he felt there was no justification for it, as many believe, and he did not want to be a soldier at risk of dieing for Bush's personal maybe the other war was more justified, in his mind.

  14. hanging by a thread? please. just because people hate bush does not mean america is hanging by a thread. get over it. sure, the economy needs some help and has seen better times, but America is still a strong and probably the strongest country around.

  15. Regardless why he chose to fight the fact is that he is fighting in a foreign military and that makes him a traitor.

  16. This is not about Bush.

    There was an enemy within that was in our country before Bush and will still be within our country after Bush.

    Day by day we are committing National Suicide.

  17. if you say so.

    and about the traitor - you seem to be all emotional about it, but if the law does not call him a traitor, he is not a traitor. You might not like it, but I am sure he does not like some of the things you do. So be it.

  18. Of course I am all emotional about this.

    The guy is a traitor.

    He certainly is no American!

    I hope he stays in Israel as we have enough traitors as it is in America.

    I wouldn't be mad had he first renounced his US citizenship.

  19. Steve; traitor has a specific legal definition as one who has committed treason. From the Constitution:

    "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.
    The Congress shall have Power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted."

    What offense listed above does a citizen who joins a non-hostile foreign military commit?

    If, of course, his service with the foreign army puts him in conflict with the US, then yes, he has committed treason. But otherwise?

    Many people have dual loyalties; to their country and to their religion, perhaps. We recognize this concept so long as the two don't conflict (and where they do, there are even measures in place such as the Coward^H^H^H^H^H^HConscientious objector laws). Why can't the same be applied to non-conflicting citizenships?

    At such point as the two conflict, then yes, one must choose. Until such time, however, why shouldn't one (who fulfills the legal requirements of both countries, such as taxation) be able to enjoy both citizenships? [unless one is some wacko moonbat who believes that US policy is dictated by a cabal of evil Zionists bent on conquering Iraq with American blood...]

  20. In your heart you can hold total loyalty to one country. Citizenship demands that your total loyalty is to the country you are a citizen of. Therefore your loyalty should be to the country you are a citizen in especially when it comes to the important issues of risking your life for YOUR country and voting for the leaders of your country.

    So, no it has to be the choice between one country or the other.

  21. "Bush's personal vendetta".

    That wasn't the reason. But say it was - SO WHAT!.

    Bush's father was, as much as I disliked him an US President and no foreign leader should try to assassinate a US President and get away with it, not even when the US President is George Herbert Walker Bush.

    Iraq is an important step in our war on terror. Yeah it is only one front in a many front war but it is a front that we must win. And then on to Iran or Syria

    I hope it's Iran as I almost have a "personal vendetta" against them. I didn't know anyone who were directly effected but the Iranian Hostage Crisis was a great embarrassment for my country. I was only in the six grade but I still remember the shame we had that even thought we were one of the strongest countries on earth we could be held hostage by the likes of Iran.

    And it did feel like we all were held hostage in a way. It was how the ABC show "Nightline" got started. Each night on that program it was day ## of America Held Hostage on that program. The Iranian Hostage Crisis was also where the whole yellow ribbon thing began.

    I do believe the world is a lot safer without Saddam. And it will be even safer still when Iran gets what they deserve.

  22. dearest commentors of my brothers blog. i am the traitor. here in the flesh and blood responding to our comments.

    theoretically, yes, i am a traitor.

    but you forget, the world we live in isnt painted in black and white. its a blend of myriads and prisms of shades of gray.

  23. pumbaa thank you for admitting that you are a traitor.

    Now, just renounce your US citizenship and I can gain some amount of respect for you.

    I think it is much better for people who in their heart shold loyalty to another country than their citizenship to just be honest and renounce their US citizenship. If they can't be an American citizen in full mind heart and soul then just be honest with us and become a citizen of a country that they can do that for.

    I really won't have hard feelings as long as you don't launch some parting insults upon my country on your way out the door.

  24. I think it is much better for people who in their hearts hold loyalty to another country than their citizenship to just be honest and renounce their US citizenship.

    Honestly, I will not be offended unless when you renounce your US citizenship you have some parting attacks upon my country. Just type up that although America has been very good for me, I have realized that in my heart I am an Israeli or something to that effect.

    No, I wouldn't be offended and I could then even see you as a great person defending your homeland against our common enemy - the islamofascists.

    So, please just kindly renounce your citizenship to America.

  25. "...but you forget, the world we live in isn't painted in black and white. its a blend of myriads and prisms of shades of gray."

    You are technically right but fundamentally wrong about that. In the end the world is Black and White. You just have to look beyond the gray to see it.

  26. pumbaa I would be the first to agree that in this world there is no principle that can or should be upheld 100 percent of the time. There will always be the exceptions, or the times where the lesser evil of violating a principle will prevent a greater evil.

    And there will indeed be times when you might have to do seemingly paradoxical. You might indeed find yourself in a situation where to save a village you would indeed have to destroy it. Or in the movie "National Treasure" to protect the Declaration of Independence to protect it you have to steal it. Those situations come up.

    Situations where to uphold the rule of law you might have to violate it. To protect freedom you might have to condemn some people to slavery. Those situations do come up. I believe that exceptions and seemingly contractory behavior is indeed a part of life.

    But the truth is yours' isn't one of those cases. You had other options. The biggest of those being renouncing your US citizenship before serving in the Israeli army.

  27. steve - you are entitled to your opinion as to what he should have done, but the law does not agree with you and does not call him a traitor or his actions treasonous.


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