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Jun 24, 2009

Interesting Machlokes: Prayers that don't make it up to Heaven

There is what turns out to be an interesting machlokes among modern day poskim as to what is the cause for our prayers not making it up to heaven.

Rav Moshe Sternbuch was recently quoted widely as having said that not being careful enough in issues of shaatnez is the issue disturbing the ascent our prayers.

Today, Rav Wosner said something that seems to indicate he argues. Rav Wosner said that our talking during davening, and our being busy with other things not related to tefilla, along with ringing cellphones, is what causes our prayers not make it up to the top.
He added that if we would stop talking during davening, nobody would get cancer anymore.

11 comments:

  1. He added that if we would stop talking during davening, nobody would get cancer anymore.
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    Is the cancer worse when you talk on your cellphone during davening?

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  2. Talking during davening is bad. It isn't the only bad thing people do. Does he think that if we wouldn't talk during davening that we would be protected from cancer despite our other sins or does he think that it is the talking which is the reason for the cancer? Either way, I wonder why he can be so sure of himself.
    I also wonder if he is being quoted correctly.

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  3. Sounds to me like Rav Wosner is simply stating the obvious. To put it in simpler terms: it's a case of cause and effect - if you don't daven (properly), your "tefillos" don't go anywhere.

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  4. Did Rav Wosner (who is he BTW?) really say this? Is this a statement to be taken seriously?

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  5. if you don't daven (properly), your "tefillos" don't go anywhere.
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    Why can't Rabbanim speak with such clarity?

    Go to the head of the shul!

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  6. who says that our tefillos are not getting to heaven? maybe they are and God is answering no?

    How do these people know this but not the lotto0 numbers?!?!?!?

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  7. Rav Wosner is one of the big rabbis i Bnei Brak. He is considered one of the gedolim.

    the original article was posted on the haredi website Etrog - I see it now at http://www.tog.co.il/he/TorahNew.aspx?id=433 but that is different than the original article I saw. This is longer and also talks about something his son said on the same issue.

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  8. I don't know where the concept of our teffilot are not answered comes from. I know many people (myself included) who feel that they have been answered in a previous way.

    Just this afternoon I was walking home and started regretted not taking the bus. I thought it would be nice if I could get a ride for the last couple of blocks. Immediately someone from my building pulled up and offered me a ride.

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  9. Ehwhy, that Olam Hazeh will now be deducted from your Olam Habah.

    Seriously, the Gemarah talks about Sha'arei Tefilah now being closed and only Sha'arei Dema'ot being open. Zeel U'gmor.

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  10. I think there is a little confusion. The person that [first] said this is the grandson of Reb Shmuel Halevi Wosner, followed by comments from his son. They ostensibly said it in the name of their grandfather/father, however I am not convinced that Reb Shmuel actually would have said it that way. They are all close relatives of mine and Reb Shmuel is always very judicious in his manner of speech and I doubt he said "cancer can be cured/avoided" or anything like that.

    That said, I have no doubt that doing other things (talking, etc) during tefillah "breaks the connection" to Hashem.

    Mark

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  11. Rafi not G.

    It seems to me a no-brainer that if you don't have any kavanah in tefillah your prayer is a lot less valuable than if you did. I don't need a "gadol" to reveal that one to me.

    All other hocus-pocus connections of unrelated mitzvot are in my not humble enough and unlearned opinion precisely that. We have heard in recent months that world recession is being caused by mixed seating on buses and now that it's continuation is because of shaatnez. That's unless you've been praying for it to continue, because in that case your prayers are being answered, shaatnez or no.

    Maybe we should run a clinical trial on the connection between talking in shul, wearing synthetic fibers, new incidences of cancer and its miraculous cure.

    ReplyDelete

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