Apr 22, 2012

Comments On Badatz Post-Pesach Kashrus Guiide

JKN has a post-Pesach kashrus update from the Badatz Eida Charedit. JKN only took this info from the Badatz guide, and therefore any comments I make are only directed toward the Badatz Eida guide and not toward JKN (unless explicitly stated otherwise).

I found a couple of points in the update comment-worthy.

Excerpts from the guide (not using the same numbering system as the original):

  1. Soup powder contains some uncooked ingredients so it may not be added to heated items above ‘yad soledes bo’ on Shabbos. 
  2. Rice packaged in a vacuum may be presumed insect free and does not require inspection. One wishing to be ‘mehudar’ (exceeding the required) may perform a superficial inspection however. 
  3. There is no fear of aluminum pans having a coating of non kosher oil for as long as they exhibit the badatz logo. 
  4. Regarding hard cheeses sold in chunks or sliced. If one buys from shopkeepers, one must make certain the knife used is exclusive for this product and that it is kosher and was toiveled. 

My comments per item:

  1. this is an interesting point, something I did not know. Anyways, I thought it was all basically chemicals and uncooked stuff and not really dehydrated soup and would never have cooked it on Shabbos (if I would use it as all).
  2. If it does not require any inspection, why is it called "mehudar" to inspect it anyway? and once one wants to be mehudar and inspect something that needs no inspection, why only a "superficial inspection" - why can't such a person do a full inspection to be even more mehudar?
  3. what if the aluminum pans bear a different hechsher? I understand they only guarantee their own, but their language makes it sound like they are the only ones who are ok
  4. hard cheeses cut by shopkeepers? why is the Badatz even talking about this? They always say they only guarantee sealed packages with their hechsher, and not once something has been opened. if a shopkeeper opens a package of Badatz cheese and cuts it, it is technically no longer certified by the Badatz. Why are they saying anything but that right now? And if they certify the entire cheese counter, shouldn't they be watching the shopkeeper and making sure he uses different knives?

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  1. 1) No comment.
    2) I think that's a fair "hiddur"... or to be more exact, it's a "prishus", since by definition "hiddurim" apply to mitzvos asei, while "prishuyos" apply to mitzvos lo taaseh. A hiddur/prishus is by definition going beyond the letter of the law, so I don't see why you think that's odd...?
    3) Sure they only guarantee their own stuff - why would they certify stuff that's certified by a different authority? No issue with that.
    4) My wife recently witnessed, in an outlet of one of the major supermarket chains, the woman at the deli counter couldn't find the knife to slice the cold cuts - so she went over to the milk side of the counter and "borrowed" the milk knife for this purpose. My wife reported it to management, who were duly horrified and took immediate action - but lesson learned: the deli counter of any supermarket is only as kosher as the people who work behind it.

  2. 2. so why only "superficial"?
    3. as I said, they only guarantee their own, but the way it is written it is saying that every other brand with any other logo might have non-kosher oil. that is in a sense defaming all the others. They could have said it differently, stating that they certify pans with no non-kosher oils. everything they certify is only good with a badatz according to them, this does not need to be stated any differently. since it is a translation, and I did not see the original, maybe there was a nuance missed or something. As I said, I get what they mean, just the wording seems poor to me.
    4. I agree 100%. and as I said, they should say they do not certify a cheese counter with open cheeses, unless they have a teudah saying so. if they do certify the entire counter, and not just individual cheeses, they should be making sure the guy with the knife is using it properly. if they only certify certain cheeses, they should simply say once the package is opened it is no longer under our certification as we do not know what the shopkeeper does with open packages, what knives he uses, etc. JKN has gone to great lengths to relate to the public many times the messages from the Badatz that once a seal is broken, it is no longer certified, and dont bother asking us any more about it. why here are they giving instructions abut stuff that is no longer under their certification because it has been opened?


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