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Apr 25, 2006

Where is Yossele, part II

Somehow they came to the decision that they can release Vales to house arrest, as he is not a danger to the public. I would assume that they were caving in to pressure form the haredi public, thought they will not say anything to that effect...

Granted, he is innocent until proven guilty. He is presently only a suspect and the elleged perpetrator of the abuse. It still must be proven in a court of law. However, to release him with no supervision? Is that not foolhardy? Will this become a new segment of the Where is Yossele saga? He does not need to wear an electronic cuff, he has to be supervised by his parents or grandparents and host to post a $50,000 bond. Is that somehow going to ensure he sits tight and waits for his trial? What are they thinking releasing him under these terms?


  1. Actually that is not quite accurate. He is not innocent untill proven guilty. When a suspect admits to an offense he has admitted culpability, hence he is no longer "innocent" and the behavior is no longer "alleged."
    At this point the only issue is one of punishment. Were there extenuating circumstances ie: mental illness, drug use, abuse he suffered rendering him incopmetent to gauge his actions or other reasons that may mitigate the punishment. But a trial would not be to prove innocence unless he recanted his confession, which he has not. Further, at this point he will probably take a plea bargin rather than trial.
    But an admitted and confessed baby killer is hardly innocent.

  2. good point I did not realize. However, the counter claim is that he never really confessed (and I have this information secondhand from people close to the case), rather blamed himself (e.g. he said, "I killed my baby, or something like that) and they misused his statement as a confession.
    If that is true, they might easily overturn his confession..
    (I am not defending him. to me he looks guilty, as all my info comes from the press, just as yours does. However from his standpoint, things might be different..)

    But then again, my money is on him disappearing, never to be seen again..

  3. At the onset it may have been possible (esp. for the meah shearim crowd) to claim that he mearly blamed himself. But as the article you linked notes, he provided a written conffession detailing how and why he killed his baby.

    As to why they let him out....aside from the protests, which I do not understand in the slightest,governments in general do not treat crimes against children harshly. Hit an adult and its assult. Hit a child and its disciplin. Untill a kid is killed or raped the police rarely stepin and when they do the adult is rarely punished as if the victim were anouther adult.

    Also, while its true I recievedmyinfo from the press it was not reported as speculation. When the facts of a case are murky then themedia speculates,in this case,as in many circumstances, the reporters presented the fcats released by the police. No reason at all not to believe the facts which the police released. Furthmore, when a baby is rushed to the hospital at night from having been severly abused it is doubtful that the baby committed suicide. Common sense and basic detective work dictate that in such a scenario then someone in the house killed this baby. Either a parent or sibling or guest or intruder or other relative. At least according to all reports I've seen, the only two people who had access to baby at time of the beating were the parents.

    As an aside, can you explain why meah shearim with the consent of the rabbis would take to the streets in support of this man? and specifically indict the police as blood libelers? And why this case in specific...are there no better causes then this to rally around? or is it the mere presumption of secular law being applied to a haredi that is the issue?

  4. I have no answer. The guy looks so guilty, they are painting themselves into a corner, coming out so strongly on his side.. I do not understand it other than to say your last explanation - that it is a Haredi rejection of the secular courts and secular system. But they are not saying that, so i am not sure.. They are not saying you have no right to try him. They are saying he is innocent. They are coming out of this looking like a blind defender of a baby killer. Very difficult to understand their position, unless somehow they really believe his innocence, though I do not understand how they possibly could...
    I still think he will disappear like Yossele did. The courts big mistake in this case, in my opinion, is caving in to the haredi pressure and releasing him..

  5. I agree.The courts have caved in to haredi pressure, but that is part of the system and strife within Israel. Whether it is this case, or the issue a few months ago when the religious family kidnapped and beat the boyfreind of the rabbi's daughter or not demanding army or an alternate volounteer service, the system is constantly bowing to the haredi pressure.
    But perhaps rather than protesting the courts andlooking like they are demanding a seperate system it is more savvy to create a system where they are a victimized group, persecuted by the secular system and defacto the underdog against the large oppresive government....that is the same way arafat got the palestinians international recognition when many other groups are ignored.


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