Aug 22, 2019
men teaching women about being women
The following announcement for a lecture was posted online this morning:
It strikes many people as funny, as ironic, even as inappropriate. Two men are going to lecture a room full of women about how great it is to be a Jewish princess? can they be more patronizing? can they be more patriarchal?
Somebody later made a spoof, a parody, of the ad, in order to highlight the absurdity of it. I don't know who made it but I am told it was not either of the two women in the spoofed ad. And here it is:
It is really funny, and the juxtaposition of the two ads really makes one wonder.
But one thing bothered me about the entire discussion.
the one thing I dont get about all the shock and irony expressed in these two rabbis giving a talk to women about a womanly topic is that most of the women who will be in attendance went to high schools and seminaries where most of the teachers talking to them and lecturing to them about every topic under the sun including topics about women and judaism were almost all male. So suddenly it is ironic? suddenly it is inappropriate? This is the system in orthodox judaism where the overwhelming majority of the teachers are male. maybe that should change, but do they really deserve so much scorn?
As an aside, I would note I am in favor of such change. I advocated for more female teachers and administrators in seminaries and girls high schools many years ago on this blog, especially from a tzniyus perspective (with there being so much stress and focus on tzniyus) as it seems to me somehow a tzniyus problem to have the male principal and teachers around these young women all day long and probably in many inappropriate situations. That is besides for the issue of the young women needing more frum female role models.
It strikes many people as funny, as ironic, even as inappropriate. Two men are going to lecture a room full of women about how great it is to be a Jewish princess? can they be more patronizing? can they be more patriarchal?
Somebody later made a spoof, a parody, of the ad, in order to highlight the absurdity of it. I don't know who made it but I am told it was not either of the two women in the spoofed ad. And here it is:
It is really funny, and the juxtaposition of the two ads really makes one wonder.
But one thing bothered me about the entire discussion.
the one thing I dont get about all the shock and irony expressed in these two rabbis giving a talk to women about a womanly topic is that most of the women who will be in attendance went to high schools and seminaries where most of the teachers talking to them and lecturing to them about every topic under the sun including topics about women and judaism were almost all male. So suddenly it is ironic? suddenly it is inappropriate? This is the system in orthodox judaism where the overwhelming majority of the teachers are male. maybe that should change, but do they really deserve so much scorn?
As an aside, I would note I am in favor of such change. I advocated for more female teachers and administrators in seminaries and girls high schools many years ago on this blog, especially from a tzniyus perspective (with there being so much stress and focus on tzniyus) as it seems to me somehow a tzniyus problem to have the male principal and teachers around these young women all day long and probably in many inappropriate situations. That is besides for the issue of the young women needing more frum female role models.
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By that logic, the whole Torah was given by a man, Moshe Rabbenu, so I guess they can just ignore the Torah.
ReplyDeletethat is one of the central arguments of feminism.
DeleteBy that "logic", you must lose most of your cases.
DeleteWhy don't you try Googling the phrase "reductio ad absudrum?"
DeleteYou might actually learn something, beyond your usual Charedi hatred.
no, the torah was given by god but interpreted by man. the problem is especially nowadays with much more rampant or at least known indiscretion going on that the more emphasis you place on tzniyus, the more inappropriateness is likely to occur. it makes more sense to hire more female teachers at the high school and older level. The fact of the matter is it does smell that men are teaching women about how important women are, especially coming from a rabbi like Wallerstein.
DeleteWhy don't you try Googling the phrase "reductio ad absudrum?"
DeleteWhy don't you try "non sequitur"?
The point of the parody is to point out the absurdity of men thinking they understand women better than women do. There is no logical connection to communicating laws.
fail to see the irony. SJK certainly considers herself an authority on masculinity, and uses her many platforms to lecture to men (among others) on the evils of ultra orthodox men failure to follow the secular trend of feminisation.
ReplyDeleteWe are now in the age of radical feminism. What the women have achieved in practically every area in life to have equality in the last hundred years is not good enough for them. They want to be 'men'. We have now reached the world of chelm!
ReplyDeleteRafi, ignore some of the other comments. What you posted is really funny. And appropriate. Thank you!
ReplyDeleteI don't know why you think most teachers in girls' high schools and seminaries are male. It is simply not true. There are usually some male teachers which I don't see as a chisaron. It serves a purpose to provide a more varied learning experience. It does not imply that female teachers are any less capable or interesting.
ReplyDeleteperhaps things have changed. that's good. I have much less familiarity with today's seminaries and schools than I did with the sems and high schools, 10 and 20 and 30 years ago. on Facebook people are telling me that a majority of teachers in sems today are female. that's good. I still know many male heads of sems, but I am happy to hear female teachers are common and even possibly the majority today
Deletethis is all Flatbush girl has a Personal Issue with rabbi Wallerstein and a Large platform
ReplyDeleteI personally don't get it, but Rabbi W (and some others) has a following among young women (and I guess his alumni.) Not that it's a lot of money, but they'll gladly pay the admission fee.
ReplyDelete