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Oct 16, 2012

Degel HaTorah Heading Toward A Split

According to various reports in the haredi media, the split in the Litvishe haredi community is now just about official. After splitting from Yated and forming their own newspaper "HaPeles", the group headed by Rav Shmuel Auerbach has supposedly now begun the process of splitting off from Degel, and presumably from UTJ as well. The straw that broke the camels back was when Degel decided to not include R' Menachem Carmel in the list for the upcoming elections. (source: Kikar, among others)

1. If the litvishe community had problems of its own passing the minimum threshold for elections and had to run together with the hassidic groups (and vice versa of course), I am not sure why this new group thinks they will pass the threshold on their own. This could just be a bluff, because they really have to realize they have no chance on their own. This could also be a show of strength, willing to sacrifice the haredi community in these elections, for their own benefit for upcoming future elections.

2. This wont just affect the new party, but now Degel is going to be smaller as well. By how much, remains to be seen, but smaller they will be. Will this affect the balance of power in UTJ? Will they reassess the arrangement and positions of the various groups, pushing Degel to lower positions?

3. With TOV possibly running as well on it's own ticket, the effect on Degel and UTJ will be compounded. If they all actually go through with their splits,  the hassidim of UTJ might do well to dump Degel completely so they dont get weighed down by a group that basically will be bringing very little to the table.

4. These are turning out to be very interesting elections, and we are only just getting started!

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  1. As long as it's all L'Sheim Shamayim.....

  2. They are planning on having a sefardi leading the list in an attempt to get some Sephardi charedi votes. This could be a disaster for the charedi world if they lose seats because of this.

  3. Didn't TOV promise they'd never run nationally, only on the Beitar and other city tickets? Or once they got written off by Rav Shteinman despite the video when he gave them his blessing, they just don't have to care anymore?

  4. Miriam - I dont remember what TOV promised and what they just said as relevant then. They might have just said that at that time they werent going to be competing nationally. I dont remember. Anyways , I dont see why they should be beholden to anybody, after they were rejected anyways. If they made such a promise, it might be an issue, but they dont owe anything to anybody..

  5. http://www.kikarhashabat.co.il/%D7%94%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%97-%D7%A7%D7%A0%D7%99%D7%91%D7%A1%D7%A7%D7%99-%D7%A0%D7%92%D7%93-%D7%94%D7%A8%D7%91-%D7%92%D7%A8%D7%95%D7%A1.html

    is this another wrinkle?

  6. sad that a halachic argument has to become so nasty..

  7. yeah, cancelling a yated subscription; pretty rough stuff.

    do you know what is the halachic argument?

  8. I dont know more than what is in the article. Rav gross paskened something about electricity and Rav Kanievsky disagrees with that. There are lots of machlokets in halacha, but instead of leaving it at that, and perhaps saying he disagrees, Rav gross is wrong, etc. he called on people to remove Rav gross's book from their houses as this psak will lead to chillul shabbos.

    The response, if ti comes, as inane as it is, is still an escalation. Getting rid of the yated and subscribing to Peles is not just a newspaper subscription, but it also almost definitely means he will be supporting Rav Shmuel Auerbachs new party which will no longer just be the yerushalmim but will expand to bnei braq, hitting UTJ even more. and that will lead to another response, with each side passuling the other.


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