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Mar 5, 2009

Coincidence? I think not!

Last night my shiur held a siyum. We finished learning Yoreh Dei'ah vol.3 and began learning Even Ha'Ezer.

Even Ha'Ezer deals mostly with the halachos relevant between man and wife, and it starts off with the topic of "Be Fruitful and Multiply" - Pirya V'Rivya.

As we were going through an introduction, a guy comes in and asks to say a few words. He tells us how he has been married 6 years and they are infertile, the treatments are not covered by the national health care and cost him $2000 per month. He and his wife both work and that is how they pay their regular living expenses, but they cannot afford the expense of the medicine and treatments....

Talk about good timing! Just as we were learning the importance of the mitzva of having children, this guy shows up and describes his problem.

Of course people gave him money and good wishes.

He would have had even better timing if he should up 20 minutes later, right after we came across a statement in the rishonim (if I remember correctly) that said one should give money to help others, who cannot, have children...


  1. where is the exact source? It's a great mareh makom to know of!


  2. maharsha - massechet shabbos 31a

  3. huh? Does he live in Israel? They are covered here.

  4. all medicines are covered? he said the shots of medicine he is taking are not covered...
    yes he is israeli and lives here

  5. NOT all medicine is covered here. BASIC things arecovered, as well as things "they" deem nessecary

  6. I think he said the name of the medicine he was getting, but I don't remember it (it did not mean anything to me, so I was not really paying attention)..
    He said his is not covered. he did not say no fertility treatment is covered....

  7. I believe it is a matter of getting the better insurance package. The better (more expensive) packages have a larger 'medicine basket'.

    If you see him again, tell him it may end up being cheaper for him to get the more expensive package to have more covered.

  8. I doubt I'll see him again, but if I do I'll mention it...
    As an aside, I remember he said he is on Macabi, but I have no idea if he has any supplemental coverage or just the basic....

  9. there are some not covered, but if you take out the more than basic package a lot, and I meant a vast portion, are. He went to our shul as well.

  10. so did you or someone else there think of asking him about the coverage?

  11. Rafi, as far as I've heard, fertility treatments for at least one child are covered in the sal briut. http://www.clalit.org.il/meir/Content/Content.asp?CID=182&u=508

    "Health fund regulations determine that a couple without two children can receive in vitro fertilization treatment paid for by the state, until pregnancy is achieved. There are no limitations to the number of attempts excluding clear medical indications detailed in the rulebook.
    Subsidized treatment stops when a couple has two children. Couples with two children, who want a third baby have to follow the rules of their insurance policy. Most health funds cover in vitro fertilization treatment for a third and fourth child. But you should check your health fund agreement. The health basket places no restriction on treatment for ovulation induction."

  12. Maccabi is better for infertility than the rest.

    But even with the expensive plan
    you have to pay a percentage of the medicine.(Much cheaper than America but still adds up)

    Then you have transportation to the hospitals and pharmacys multiple times.(With cabs a requirement for procedures).Not to mention missed work.

    That's just for the minimum.
    If you don't want to wait 3 months for an apt you need to pay private.

    If you want better treatment that's private too.

    It's very difficult to go through all these procedures with time and pain and shlepping and end up with
    whoever's on call. A better doctor can improve the chances alot.

    Everyone's treatments are different.
    Without going into details it's very possible to be 2000$ without private.

    Someone in the parsha

  13. did you ever locate the source about women going first?

  14. anon - I put it in the comments of the post way back then

  15. I tend to not be sympathetic to meshluchim. His manners and his demonstration that they were trying to help himself left a good impression.

    I asked him a few questions, that someone lying would not be able to answer. He is in touch with all of the proper support organizations.

    I hope the generosity of the community will bring them success and we won't need to see him begging again.

  16. I have many post up on Even Haezer simanim 4,5,6 - from Perek Asarah Yuchsin
    I keep adding posts, so check back for more.

  17. .....or he could've arrived when you would be discussing the Yam Shel Shlomo who says one is yotzai pru urvu with adoption. :-0


  18. ok, i located it in the old thread. Thanks!!


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